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Author Topic: Trouble ahead?  (Read 223 times)
chippyzip
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« on: August 29, 2018, 08:42:54 »

News from the BMF web site about the new "E10" fuel that could be hitting fuel stations in the UK. It makes very sobering reading, and although my 2014 X10 might be ok, I'm sure my 1970 Vespa Sprint Veloce, sure will have problems! https://www.bmf.co.uk/news/show/will-ethanol-blended-fuel-damage-my-motorcycle

Graham 
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Dave Milnes
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« Reply #1 on: August 29, 2018, 09:27:54 »

I doubt in the UK we will see much E10 as we do not produce enough crops to supply the industry, we can barely produce enough for the food industry. Fuel prices may actually drop when the tax isn't based on the cost of crude oil as much.
As for the loss of power, the same can be said of LPG but if you turn up the mixture a bit it is barely noticeable and the lower cost easily cancels this out still leaving large savings.
We have not jumped on the E5 bandwagon all that much in Europe let alone the UK so I have a feeling these articles in the press are being a bit pessimistic and still not allowing the actual truth to get in the way of a sensational story.
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Mike H
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« Reply #2 on: August 29, 2018, 11:10:12 »

I agree, scare-mongering just for a good shock-horror type story. Also dangerously inaccurate. Ethanol does not dissolve metals. It is simple alcohol, same as what you get in alcoholic drinks. As regards plastics, it can penetrate between the plastic molecules because is it a smaller molecule. True this can cause hoses and seals to disintegrate and plastic fuel tanks to swell*. As for rust in steel tanks, I'm pretty sure I've always seen some amount of rust in my tanks ever since I started biking. And is why you have fuel filters. Solution, use Viton hoses etc., and steel tanks. Sorted.

My biggest issue where carburettors were involved has been the 'fall-out' of hard green or brown crud that deposits in the float chamber and clogs up jets, when the petrol dries out. But I'm sure it's not ethanol doing that, but I don't know what it is. Bottom line is, modern petrol is not made to be compatible with carburettors any more, so problems can be expected. It got so I used to drain the float bowls if the bike(s) were going to be left for longer than say a week. Which is a bit of a chore.

Latterly I solved my carburettor problems by totally switching to EFI vehicles.


(* This is a massive problem with e.g. Moto Guzzi's from about 15 years ago or so. So much so factory has switched back to steel tanks for their newer models. What happens is, literally you just take the (plastic) tank off for whatever reason, then it won't go back on! It's too long! A couple of owners of older ones have asked on the forums whether it's possible to 'upgrade' an older model with a steel tank. Unfortunately also needs newer style fuel pump so not cheap or simple.)



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JohnF
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« Reply #3 on: August 31, 2018, 21:29:44 »

Regardless of whether it dissolves plastics etc. If it’s not appropriate, don’t use it! Here in France we have three pumps for petrol - 95 - 98 - E10, and then diesel. Surely tis quite simple? The E10 pump has a label telling you what vehicles can use it.
Sounds like an end of summer beat up. John
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Mike H
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« Reply #4 on: September 01, 2018, 12:47:52 »

Unfortunately it's very confusing in the UK. Pumps are not marked, except with the BS (British Standard) number, but looking it up, it only says "may contain 5% ethanol" - from the AA:

1. At this level there’s no issue of compatibility with car fuel systems and no need to mark pumps to tell customers that the fuel may contain biofuel. (my italics)
2. This doesn’t mean that all fuel actually contains 5% biofuel, only that it may contain anywhere between none and 5%.

E10 – petrol with up to 10% Ethanol.
3. In March 2013 the maximum level of Ethanol allowed in petrol increased from 5% to 10% by volume.

"any petrol containing more than 5% Ethanol must be clearly labelled on the pump as ‘unleaded petrol 95 E10’."

Can't remember seeing any yet.

Another 'myth' is 97 octane (what we call 'Super', 'Ultimate', etc.) is ethanol free. Personally I don't believe it, or if it is, it won't be for much longer I'm thinking.





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« Reply #5 on: September 01, 2018, 12:53:26 »

PS: I should mention the people who have had problems with swelling tanks, disintegrating hoses etc., have done so with the 5%. Hence the problem of not knowing whether a particular petrol pump will include ethanol or not. And it's all very well saying the super is OK to use because it's ethanol free, but it's not suitable for all engines.

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Derek
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« Reply #6 on: September 05, 2018, 05:23:23 »

http://www.fema-online.eu/website/index.php/2018/09/04/fuel-labelling/
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