Throttle body X10 350 fault problem ?

[r1speeedyrider]

I have just had my bike put on diagnostics PADS and it has come up with throttle body error code, but to replace it cost big money, £800 and it may not even fix the issue. The bike is only worth £1000 fixed, or £100 scrap.
 Has anyone had throttle body experience that can give my info as if I replace the body and it doesnt fix the problem then im throwing away £800. The bike fires up but won't run or idle properly. It went wrong suddenly, I did a 60 mile run in torrential rain, stoped for 5 minutes and then when I started the bike the problem was there. Coils,cap,HT lead and plugs all changed.

[Dave Milnes]

See if you can find a second hand one on Ebay. The throttle body is a simple mechanical item with the addition of a couple of sensors and an idle stepper motor. Sounds more like the TPS sensor which may not be removable from the body has failed if it isn't responding to twisting the throttle. I would clean all the connectors and spray down inside with carb cleaner and if no improvement look for a used item. All the 350s will be the same so a Beverley or other model should swap over. Worth a go before either scrapping or spending silly money.

[r1speeedyrider]

I have checked fowlers.co.uk and they have part listed for £356 inc vat so not so bad. The throttle bode comes with ECU and needs to be matched with the key for the security immobiliser. Garage told me I cant use 2nd hand and this needs to be replaced to get rid of error code before they can go any further.

[polecat]

try this guy juan brazal 07587092008
polecat

[r1speeedyrider]

try this guy juan brazal 07587092008
polecat

 How can this guy help me ? with info or with parts ? thanks

[polecat]

sorted my x7 250 with matching keys and made the immobiliser work with new keys not going to hurt to ask
polecat

[Dave Milnes]

Forgot the ECU was part of the TB on the X10.

[r1speeedyrider]

 The garage thats working on my bike give me the impression they dont want to work on my bike as it isnt easy cost effective repair. It could have wiring loom problem if its not the ECU/TB so I think my best options are to either just Ebay the bike for parts or order the ECU/Throttle body and fit and match my keys to it myself.
 The garage bill so far will be £150-250.

[Dave Milnes]

If you get the TB/ECU and fit it then program in your keys and it still doesn't work, although that eliminates the ECU you then need find the fault elsewhere in the wiring, you cannot sell either ECU to get some of your money back as once paired with keys are no good to anyone else.
Maybe better to fully examine all connectors, sensors and loom for damage first and if you find anything slightly dodgy, fix that first and see if it sorts the problem, or even get a new loom as at least you can sell the old one if that isn't the problem. Faults suddenly appearing after a wet ride are quite often just water ingress to a connector or sensor which throws the ECU an out of tolerance reading.
Does the error code not drill down to a more concise fault rather than just 'throttle body' error.

[r1speeedyrider]

The garage told me that they need to replace the TB to clear the TB error code 1st,I think they mentioned hard fault vs another type of faultthen see if that fixes the problem before they can proceed. In their opinion its not worth it due to cost. I can understand because if its wiring its going to be a pain, also the garage won't fit 2nd hand parts. I assume a liability thing.
  I did remove connectors and wd40 them soon after the bike broke at the end of January. It has been started 2 or 3 times since then, and the fuse box was taped up to insulate it from the weather as I new this was an issue when I bought it.

[roadster]

From memory I think I provided the X10 workshop manual for the wotmeworry ftp site https://manuals.wotmeworry.org.uk/Piaggio/Piaggio%20X10/X10%20350ie%20Exec/

It has plenty of information about the electronic diagnosis so might be worth downloading if you haven't already got it. Unfortunately the circuit diagram images are pretty useless but text and pictures are good.

[Dave Milnes]

I don't get the need to replace the TB complete with ECU as the new ECU won't have any codes to clear. The codes should be cleared from the existing ECU but that wouldn't help as if there really is a fault it would re-occur.
Is the garage a Piaggio/Aprillia/Gilera dealer with the correct diagnostic tool or are they using a generic OBD tool? If they have the proper tool, despite it not being recommended normally, can they not do a throttle body reset, which sets all sensors and stepper motors back to as new settings not allowing for wear and tear?

[r1speeedyrider]

They are my nearest Piaggio dealer that can use the official PADS diag. The TB and ECU are 1 part and cannot be ordered seperately. So they need to replace that part to try to get the error gone and if that doesnt fix the problem but removes the error code then the fault still has to be found.

https://www.fowlersparts.co.uk/parts/5689264/x10-350-x10-350-4t-4v-i-e-e3-chassis-number-prefix-zapm76201-zapm76200-2012-2015-4t-4v-i-e-e3-chassis-number-prefix-zapm76201-za/throttle-body-injector-union-pipe

[Dave Milnes]

Seems like your only option is to order and fit the TB/ECU yourself and program in your existing keys, or scrap the bike. You might then be able to send the ECU off to a specialist such as the guy Polecat mentioned for a diagnostic and bypass the immobiliser so it can be used as a spare or even sold as key matching would not be an issue.

[r1speeedyrider]

Yes, I think I will get the bike back and try to inspect the TB/ECU and its nearest wiring and connectors to try to see if I can take it apart, clean and spot anything amiss. Then I'll order the TB if nothing improves.
 Fowlers have told me Piaggio have a block on some parts, which includes the TB, so there is no hurry to order. I assume it could be a few weeks until the week is lifted, then at least 6 weeks after that until I would get the TB. I could try to get a 2nd hand wiring loom just in case, but I dont know if I have the motivation to pull the whole bike apart as I have no undercover workspace where I live.

[Dave Milnes]

https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2315708.m570.l1313&_nkw=piaggio+throttle+body&_sacat=0
Anything here that might be worth a punt?
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/313548294611?hash=item4900ef49d3:g:BUYAAOSwnCVgylb1
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/313539060183?hash=item49006261d7%3Ag%3AIfIAAOSwMqtgylcE&LH_ItemCondition=3

[r1speeedyrider]

The Beveley 350 would be the closest match but it is a different part number CM0852095 vs CM085210 although both look same with ECU. I don't know why there is a big price difference. Not sure if things like traction control,ABS,ECO mode, etc are different. The ignition mapping could be diffrent due to diffrent size wheels. So the ECU would be diffrent but TB may be same.

https://www.fowlersparts.co.uk/parts/5676322/beverly-350-beverly-350-4t-4v-ie-e3-sport-touring-chassis-number-prefix-zapm69300-zapm69400-2012-2014-4t-4v-ie-e3-sport-touring-/throttle-body-injector-union-pipe

[r1speeedyrider]

I just spoke to the garage and they wont work on my bike anyway as they cant promise to find the fault and it could be too much hassle for them. They probably dont want my bike sitting in their workshop for months either.
   They did clarify the price for the TB as including labour where I thought it was just for the part so I misheard them there.

[Techno]

Bit late to this but, in my experience is rarely the MIU that fails but rather other connected sensors, power supply, earth could also be the fuel pump, stepper motor, by-pass or incorrectly set/reset/faulty TPS.  What was/is the bike doing to make you get a diagnostic check, what code are you getting i.e. P0???

It could just be water ingress in the plug. 

A lot of these dealers (stealers) haven't got a clue they just want to change whole units.