Bike strip down

[Techno]

As you know I've only recently got into scooters, the X10 being my first purely as a cheaper and time saving way of getting to work.

I love the bike, but it's really not the best when it comes to build quality and serviceability or rather ease of  

Mine was acquired last month with just over 7000k on it, outwardly it's in good condition, the bike had been serviced only 2 weeks before it was part exchanged to the dealer I got it from.  On buying it the bike was checked over (I bet) but not serviced as it's service book clearly shows it was serviced only 850 miles ago.

Once I got the bike home I set about checking things over, being an experienced bike mechanic I tend to end up stripping them as I find no end of issues, the X10 wasn't any different.  The bike has been serviced from new by the same dealer or rather "stealer", for which I have all the work sheets and receipts.  Thus far these are the issues: -

1. Plugs never been changed
2. Oil filter certainly wasn't changed at 6000k
3. Air filter looks to have never been cleaned again certainly not at 6000k
4. Broken bodywork clips.

Problems I had in the month I've owned the bike and the almost 1000k I've put on it: -

1. Front left caliper partly seized pads, front left pins are now free, front right pins are now rounded trying to get them out, back I've left for another day but they both work fine!
2. Was holding back at around 7k, just like fuel starvation but not all the time, bike almost cut out on me at 70mph on the dual carriageway!
3. Seat lock jammed.
4. Fuel cap stuck.
5. Throttle with excessive play.

What I've done so far : -

1. Changed the plug
2. Sorted seat lock
3. Sort fuel cap
4. Stripped and cleaned front left caliper, fitted TRW pads.
5. Head light mod.
6  Stripped the bike of all bodywork but the nose cone and inner under seat.
7. Clean out the fuse tray.
8. Cleaned out the number plate light.  

What's left to do: -

1. Carry out a proper 6k service.
2. Fit HID low beam.
3. Fit Phillips extreme H1 high beam bulb.
4. Fit better horn.
5. Sort the caliper pad pins.
6. Treat the bike with ACF50.
7. Sort out fuse tray guard.
8. Sort out a number plate light guard.
9. Repair broken bodywork clips.  

Once all that is done I'll hopefully have a reliable bike that will get me through the coming winter  





[url=https://flic.kr/p/W5KgSQ]
[url=https://flic.kr/p/Vrwofa]
[url=https://flic.kr/p/W55BJ1]



Clean filter  

850 miles  



More to follow.

                

[The Bern]

HID, iirc doesn't get a good pattern, think it was Solo that ended up binning HID's & fitting Osram Night Breakers & got far better results on one his many X's

[Expat47]

Techno, can I assume that the last photo above is the end result of the headlamp modification?

[chippyzip]

Nice looking scoot- same colour as mine! It might be a good idea for the rest of us to show photo's as you go when repairing stuff on the scoot. Although there is a manual of sorts, the 500cc workshop manual (in which mine is) has a mixture of both Italian and English descriptions, making repairing tasks a bit tricky!

Let us know how you get on!

Graham 

[Techno]

Techno, can I assume that the last photo above is the end result of the headlamp modification?

Yes that's correct.

[Expat47]

Yes that's correct.

Thanks. This is going to make it a lot easier for my mechanic. I don't "DO" electricity, in fact, I really believe that all these wires and words are used by wizards (who create this mystical power) to fool us mundanes (muggles in the UK) into paying for it.

[Techno]

HID, iirc doesn't get a good pattern, think it was Solo that ended up binning HID's & fitting Osram Night Breakers & got far better results on one his many X's

Hi Bern

There's HID and then there's HID.  As with most things you get what you pay for.  I use and have done since they started HID4U their kits are excellent quality cost a little more but aren't your cheap "Chinese" Ebay rip off's although I've no doubt they are made in China.  They used to use ballasts from Germany I've had them fitted to my bikes and have fitted quite a few to others bikes, I've got a kit fitted to my workhorse/run around MK4 Astra Est they've been on it since 06 no problems as yet. 

I did some trails with these guys back in 05 fitting them to several Jap sports bikes.  You're right of course beam patterns can be an issue, it's all to do with the focal point which is controlled by the distance and height of the bulb element form the reflector, fractions of a mm count. I'm sure you've noticed an increase in maladjusted headlights of recent years?  This I believe is due to the difficulty of actually fitting bulbs these days and the service offered by Halfords and others to do this for you, only they don't fit them correctly.  Up side down, or only 2 of the 3 tangs engaged, this moves that all important focal point and you get poor light and/or dazzle other road users.

The bulbs they use are properly made, the light they put out is pronominal, that said they aren't too cleaver for high beam as although massively improved the warm up time doesn't give you the instant light you require, so I stick to halogen Phillips Extreme.  The kit I'm fitting is their latest so this may have improved further, the next step is LED which is instant, but at present quality stuff is very expensive but as they get more common the price will reduce as it's done with HID.           

[Mike H]

Have you tried the bike with the stock bulbs on a dark country road? Works fine for me.

How are you going to repair the bodywork clips?

[Techno]

Have you tried the bike with the stock bulbs on a dark country road? Works fine for me.

Once you've used a good HID set up you just can't go back the amount of light is massive, I'm not saying the standard set up is bad HID is just soo much better.

How are you going to repair the bodywork clips?

I've used araldite I think there be fine for refitting not so sure about removing again, the clip idea is cheap and nasty.

[Mike H]

The cynic in me says they're deliberately fragile to make you buy a new panel or whatever when you inevitably break one off.  If you look at the root of the molding for each tab, it's extremely thin.

+1 for Araldite, is what I've used most successfully. Have kicked myself on a couple of occasions for breaking a tab on the old blue X10, then when I came to look at a repair, discovered it had been glued, therefore broken before! Made me feel a bit better anyway. 

[Noggin the Nog]

Really puzzling attitude Piaggio have then  to "assembly/disassembly" when you consider how huge the home market is. I can't see the ltalians going for it. Perhaps that's why we saw so many Honda &Yamaha maxi-scoots around Sorrento last month.

[Techno]

The cynic in me says they're deliberately fragile to make you buy a new panel or whatever when you inevitably break one off.  If you look at the root of the molding for each tab, it's extremely thin.

+1 for Araldite, is what I've used most successfully. Have kicked myself on a couple of occasions for breaking a tab on the old blue X10, then when I came to look at a repair, discovered it had been glued, therefore broken before! Made me feel a bit better anyway. 

I'm beginning to wonder if we are missing something i.e. there's a trick to to their disassembly, a special tool or something, as I can't see how they wouldn't get broken!  Obviously the more you do it will reduce the breakages i.e knowing where they are and what way to pull will greatly reduce the change of them being broken, but like you say they're flimsy and breakages I would be inevitable. 

Really puzzling attitude Piaggio have then  to "assembly/disassembly" when you consider how huge the home market is. I can't see the ltalians going for it. Perhaps that's why we saw so many Honda &Yamaha maxi-scoots around Sorrento last month.

Like a lot of things Italian "It's not how it functions it's all about what it looks like!" and arguably the X10 is the best looking scoot out there  A bit like Ducati, Augusta, Aprillia they are a pig to work on but are beautiful, same goes for their cars Fiat (anyone remember the Supermirafiori) , Alfa's and Ferrari.  All I've worked on over the years they are (were) all very fragile but look/ed great                             

[Mike H]

It's especially difficult if the clips have rusted. I usually use a big blunt screwdriver to prise them out, rather than just pulling.

[Techno]

She's now back together..............but oh boy what a nightmare

I now know why the X10 was a good few £1000 less than a Jap equivalent it typical Italian form over function made with parts from the bottom draw parts bin!  I can also see why stealers I mean dealers would cut corners or just plain not do what they're paid for. 

I managed to do all the following: -

1. Carry out a proper 6k service.  All that was done by the so called dealer only 800 miles before I bought the bike was they'd changed the oil I'm fairly certain they did nothing else.  The bike is now running much better than it did when I picked the bike up, this being my first scoot of any size I had no idea what they go like, mine was struggling at times, it now pulls to almost 10k no trouble, it's smooth and far more responsive and I'm now getting 250 miles from full to to still running.  I got 15.45 litres in this morning so the tank is bigger than 15 litres.
2. Fit HID low beam. Fitted
3. Fit Phillips extreme H1 high beam bulb. Fitted
4. Fit better horn. Fitted
5. Sort the caliper pad pins. all but the front right run out of time.
6. Treat the bike with ACF50. Done.
7. Sort out fuse tray guard. Done
8. Sort out a number plate light guard. Done
9. Repair broken bodywork clips.  Done.  Reassembling the bodywork without breakage was a nightmare it's way too complicated, cheap clips and self tappers everywhere at all angles.


The tape is just an added level the shield has been fitted with silicone.



HID's and horn, the blue cable ties have now been tidied up, I use blue so you could see where i fitted things. It's all reversible in very quick time. 


Extras I found while stripping the bike: -
1. Exhaust resprayed




[url=https://flic.kr/p/Vxzv9j]
2. rear caliper serviced just in time too!
3. Cleaned belt cover filter again just in time.
I got so side tracked finding all manner of things I forgot to take anymore pictures, in all I spent 3 whole days on it!!   
 

       

[Dave Milnes]

Looks good. I have always thought the Xevo and X7 were 'parts bin bottom' designs using up left over bits from the X8 and X9 as they seem to lack the design coherency of the earlier models. To leave X10 fuse boxes directly in the line of fire from wheel splash is poor design, especially when they did similar but not as bad on the X9, you'd think they would learn. Form over function was an old trait of Italian vehicles, but of late they have been a lot better except for Piaggio.

[Expat47]

I've got a whole list of "little things" that Piaggio could/should have done before building the X10. Things that just would have just made the ride that much better but, sadly, the trust I thought Europe's leader in scooters should have earned was not to be found. In short, the X10 was my 1st Italian machine and will be my last Italian machine.

Actually, had I put some serious thought into it I'd've realized that since I'd wouldn't own any Italian car why would I think they'd be any better at scooters.

[Noggin the Nog]

I think Italian "style" either gets you or it doesn't. The X10 was my second from that stable as I have owned a Guzzi Cali Special for 18 years (it was a year old when I bought it). Guzzi have various idiosyncrasies that put some people off and decide to go for the mainstream. The family even tell me that, even if I wanted to, I wouldn't be allowed to sell the Cali. If I want to see a look of horror on my son's face I tell him I'm going to be buried with it :-D
His first reaction to my buying "a scooter!" was a one of dismay. Now he's gotten to know the X10 he quite likes it too.

[Dave Milnes]

Italian vehicles probably are best suited to owners who have some knowledge and skills and are enthusiastic about their transport and who spend time tweaking and who don't mind the odd problem. Definitely not for those who don't know a relay from a rectifier and are not interested in how their vehicle works.
I will get an Alfa Romeo one day, I almost bought a 147 last week but the insurance is high so I looked at a Mito but there is no room inside.

[Techno]

I think Italian "style" either gets you or it doesn't.

I get the style hence I bought the bike, just struggle with poor engineering! That said it's way cheaper which as I said explains why.

Guzzi have various idiosyncrasies that put some people off and decide to go for the mainstream.

 
A mates brother back in the early 80's had an 850 La man's Mk3 lovely looking but again made of poor quality parts and very poor electrics at the time the clouds only had to come out and it would start playing up.      One of the first to have linked brakes when it was going it went very well, just make sure you matched the engine speed/throttle opens on change downs or it would lock the back wheel, the rear shaft limited slip diff wasn't that great!  They now go for silly money

[Techno]

Italian vehicles probably are best suited to owners who have some knowledge and skills and are enthusiastic about their transport and who spend time tweaking and who don't mind the odd problem. Definitely not for those who don't know a relay from a rectifier and are not interested in how their vehicle works.
I will get an Alfa Romeo one day, I almost bought a 147 last week but the insurance is high so I looked at a Mito but there is no room inside.

Ducati has come a long way but they're still overly complicated, I've not worked on a Italian car for a while now but would imagine they've improved too in most areas.   

[Noggin the Nog]

Designers, eh?

In my past life I inspected escalators. The engineer and I turned up to inspect some brand new ones in a very posh Birmingham store. (Note: escalators are delivered and installed in one piece).
 When we opened up the tank at the lower end (by removing the floor plate), we were confronted by a sheet metal guard which had to be removed but was secured by bolts in the bottom of the very narrow tank space.

Apparently, they are dead easy to get at when the escalator is mounted on trestles in the factory ......